That's a radical policy. There are 72 million Turks, nearly all Muslim, who will end up with the right to move to the UK if Turkey is allowed to join. Turkey is not historically a part of the West, so it will mean establishing a precedent of Western countries dissolving themselves in a federation with non-Western ones.
Why would Cameron want to do this? Liberals like Cameron see society as being made up of millions of autonomous wills. But how can a society of competing wills be harmoniously regulated? The answer of right-liberals is that the hidden hand of the free market can regulate our self-directed purposes for the overall good of society.
So there is a focus on Economic Man and his activities in the free market - as this is what is thought to successfully harmonise individual "freedom" (i.e. autonomy).
What becomes authoritative, as a principle of social administration, are market outcomes. Countries are governed as if they were companies.
So back to the right-liberal Cameron. His first reason for wanting Turkey to join the EU? He thinks it will be good for the economy:
I ask myself this: which European country grew at 11% at the start of this year? Which European country will be the second fastest growing economy in the world by 2017? Which country in Europe has more young people than any of the 27 countries of the European Union? Which country in Europe is our number one manufacturer of televisions and second only to China in the world in construction and in contracting?...
That is the first reason I am here today and it is why I have chosen to come to TOBB, right in the heart of the Turkish business community.
And who does Cameron think opposes Turkish membership? Again, he sees things along economic lines. He imagines that the opposition comes from "protectionists" who fear free trade:
Every generation has to make the argument for free trade all over again and this generation will be no different. As we build our economic relationship there are some who fear the growth of a country like Turkey, who want to retreat and cut themselves off from the rest of the world. They just don’t get it...
So let me tell you what we are going to do to beat the protectionists. We are going to work harder than ever before to break down those barriers to trade that still exist, to cut the global red tape, like by streamlining customs bureaucracy and to work towards completing the trade round that could add $170 billion to the world economy...
We are welcoming new business to Britain. And we are delighted that so many Turkish people are visiting, studying, and doing business so successfully in the United Kingdom.
Today the value of our trade is over $9 billion a year. I want us to double this over the next five years. We cannot let the protectionists win the argument.
He is blind to the idea that the UK might exist for purposes other than trade. Questions of culture, of religion, of tradition, of distinct nations of people - all these are reduced to possible impediments to free trade that must not be allowed to interfere with running society along "rational" market lines.
And so we get to see the passionate side of Cameron, the Cameron who is angered by the idea that pesky issues of culture and civilisation might get in the way of economic objectives:
it makes me angry that your progress towards EU membership can be frustrated in the way that it has been...
I will remain your strongest possible advocate for EU membership and for greater influence at the top table of European diplomacy. This is something I feel very strongly and very passionately about. Together I want us to pave the road from Ankara to Brussels.
At least Cameron has shown decisively, early in his Prime Ministership, that he is a radical right-liberal rather than a genuine conservative. This must surely make it clear to the base of the Conservative Party that they must either rebel against the party leadership or else leave and build up another party or another political movement.
I don't want to always be presenting the views of those who betray. So I'll finish by linking to someone I don't know much about, except that he is a Conservative Party MEP who has written a good reply to Cameron: If Turkey joins the EU, we should leave. Roger Helmer is proof that it's possible to have a background in business and still put national sovereignty first.
Did he ever claim to be a traditionalist? I don't recall him ever making such a claim. I think he specifically campaigned as a right-liberal.ReplyDelete
Very true he is a right liberal.ReplyDelete
I think that the worry may be overblown, though. No way Germany will *ever* approve the accession of Turkey to the EU.
Cameron won't stay leader for long if he keeps pushing this line.ReplyDelete
The UK is already part of the Caliphate.ReplyDelete
The recently arrested 7 Englishmen, including shooting one who was stopped at a light in his vehicle, in the UK over a non-existant bomb plot of a mosque. Don't worry, the police were "wroking closley with the Muslim community." But not, of course with the English community.
This is fantasitc, hot on the heels of Rudd's big big Australia policy comes another even bigger blunder by a mainstream PM.ReplyDelete
How many Conservative voters would actually want Turkey in the EU, 5 percent, 10 percent at most I would think?
As Novaseeker points out, there is little chance most countries in Europe will support this so for Cameron to come out in favour of such an unpopular and controversial policy at this time is political stupidity.
What next, a Republican Presidential candidate campaigning for gay marriage and gun control?
I like to call Cameron's right-liberalism, "propheteering," as opposed to the commonly held misconception that sellouts like him are Capitalists.
He's nothing more than a broker who steers the investor to invest in those who pay said broker the best payout. Or, if he's more cynical and capable, HE SEES Turkey as a great business investment and is creating the inevitable future in order to "capitalize." Either way, he is labeled greedy "capitalist" by those on the hard left in which MORE concessions to Turkey will be in order.
Cameron wins by giving Turkey more influence. That's what conducting business means... Gaining influence.
Which means that Western traditionalists can't forget about the absolute need to conduct business.
"Is the UK a country or a company?"ReplyDelete
Company, the Monarch is a 'corporation sole'.
I have Syrian Christian neighbors that lived in Turkey and their stories are one of horror for the 0.1% non Muslim minority (the rest were murdered). So much for the idea of 'secular' Muslims that gets crammed down our throats by the liberal media.
Declining European population, an open door policy and growing Islamic populations on the frontier is the recipe for a perfect storm.
Most europeans who have visited Turkey have only seen the prosperous western side.ReplyDelete
If they open their borders, who will come through? Secularised educated western turks? Or the dirt poor fanatically religious ones from the hills who can be made to work for a few pounds a day?
The problem for the turks is that the secularised folks don't have anywhere near as many kids as the dirt poor supporters of the current [Islamist inspired] ruling party. So that party has been gaining seats every few years for quite some time now.
As they have done this, Kemal's vision of a secular republic facing west has begun to shrink and a far older, more traditionalist Turkey has emerged.
It is interesting to see that both the Marxist and fascist inspired parties in Turkey oppose those wanting a more islamic country. Big government folks don't like traditionalist resurgence regardless of where they sit on the political spectrum.
""The recently arrested 7 Englishmen, including shooting one who was stopped at a light in his vehicle, in the UK over a non-existant bomb plot of a mosque. Don't worry, the police were "wroking closley with the Muslim community." But not, of course with the English community.""ReplyDelete
Yeah I noticed that,
The EDL [English defence League] bloke got his tires shot out with a shotgun.
They were arrested on "terror" charges which, surprise surprise, turned out to be bogus.
If that had happened to a muslim man can you imagine the outcry?
Yet another reason for traditionalists to oppose authoritarian "anti terror" laws, the media will get upset if the police use those laws on muslims, but if they use them on other dissenters like ourselves there will be nothing but silence.
"Cameron wins by giving Turkey more influence. That's what conducting business means... Gaining influence."
Yes to do buisness you need something to sell. In this case its access. Its also a perverse thing which is probably appealling in its own right.
Crikey. This is Rudd-like, to come out swinging for open borders and erode what remains of Britain's soul. If I was a Brit I'd be feeling mighty "protectionist" right now.ReplyDelete
If I was a Brit I'd be feeling mighty "protectionist" right now.ReplyDelete
Brits are brainwashed to believe they have nothing worth protecting.
Cameron was never a traditionalist, the records are there: 'hug a hoodie', work with the 'EU' without being submissive to it, also of relevance are his credentials when it comes to consuming drugs. I fully concur with Mark on the fact he is a right-liberal to the bootstraps. I have always felt I am a bit of a protectionist, Cameron's statements on Turkey are yet another incentive to reject free-trade worshippers. These people would mould and knead us until we are perfect automatons who only think in economic terms. I remember vividly my economics classes of a couple of months ago; the topic was international trade, and our professor insisted on the fact 'people are happier whenever they consume more goods'. It tells you all you need to know about right-liberals.ReplyDelete
If we tackle David Cameron's analysis of Turkey's economy, he is wrong on that count as well. Turkey has been known to have a weak financial sector, prone to several significant crises and instability over the past few years. Last time I checked Turkey's economic growth was in the red figures in 2009, the CIA World Factbook shows Turkey's economy to have declined by 5.6 % in real terms... Over the past years, Turkey's output has been increasing as a general trend, however, it has had a worrying tendency to fall sharply every now and then. Cameron is wrong Turkey is an economic asset.
As for the more realistic aspects of Turkish membership, Cameron has been trumpeting his commitment to taking powers back from Brussels, why would he stand for ensnaring yet another country into the 'EU' quagmire? MEP Danial Hannan claims friendliness to Turkey is a natural trait in British conservatives and has been so since the Crimean War and the fact Turkey was considered a bulwark against Russian expanding to the West yet it clearly overlooks Turkey's mistreatment of its Christian minority in that period, not to mention the 1915 genocide. Even though Turkey's Western coast is quite industrialised and heavily relies on tourists, it is no faithful reflection of Turkey as a whole as Western elites mistakenly believe from what they have seen during their gilded holidays. Turkey as a whole is a backward country whose minorities (or rather what is left of them) wriggle under Ankara's jackboot, its so-called secular bent is only secured by recurrent military intervention, not a beacon of stability, eh? And, above all, Turkey is 98 percent Muslim. It has a long history of seeking to destroy Christian civilisation, which it nearly achieved in gone by centuries but for the union of all Christian forces to drive them back from Vienna's gates. If Turkey is ever allowed to join the 'EU', tens of millions of Islamic primitives will pour into West European countries, mostly Germany, Britain, France and the Netherlands. And this will be made possible because momentary checks upon the entry of several Eastern members have been removed. It will be little short of a full-scale invasion, changing forever the face of Europe.
Britain belongs to the British people who overwhelmingly reject Turkey's membership to the 'EU' (pretty much as they reject their own membership to that Marxist-oriented organisation), not one European nation wants Turkey to join. In France, opposition to Turkey's membership is supported by a majority of two to one, whilst 80 % of Austrians object to it, with similar figures in Germany.
The very fact that Western elites consider allowing Turkey to join shows how diseased the spirit of our civilisation is, and how far we are on our descent down to the ultimate destruction of Western Christian civilisation. They must be halted at all costs.
Novaseeker, Liesel: the UK, as bad as it is, is in the EU. I've been to Little Arabia (aka the Manchester Airport). Is there any hope the Krauts might kick the Limeys out?ReplyDelete
Is there any hope the Krauts might kick the Limeys out?ReplyDelete
The Krauts call them Island Monkeys, not Limeys.
You mean the Monkeys still haven't left of their own accord? Weren't they just nagging about wanting their money back, and whatnot? We've already thrown our Polish plumbers at them.
What else do we have to do? Infect them with döner stands? Torture them with Vietnamese flea markets? What about unemployed communists to complain about the superiority of Stalin? Or blondes who demand that the men pee standing up? Do they really want us to go that far? Bring it on, we have the upper hand in this fight. They have no chance.
Mr. Courtman, I can't name an instance of homosexual marriage or gun control being praised, but remember that a Republican president and presidential candidate both fought for the replacement of white Americans with Oaxaca pygmies.ReplyDelete
Mr Cameron is the unaccomplished, faint-hearted child of wealthy aristocrats who has never been compelled to exert himself beyond weighing up the tastes of Bullingdon Club wines.
The office he holds is important to him not out of the obligation to protect and advance the interests of the British nation (he sees no nation, only the plot of land for EU airstrip region 14), but to gain the respect and envy of fellow international elites.
Lastly, Balkan Christian and German vehemence thankfully will prohibit the accession of Turkey, as will the fading zeal of Israel and America to promote it. The interests of Jewish chauvinism diverged from Turkey's EU membership when the commandos raided that boat in the Med.
"The Krauts call them Island Monkeys, not Limeys."
Two world wars and one world cup. Do dah.
Ouch, Jesse. Don't remind me of the last World Cup, either. I'm still smarting.ReplyDelete
Germany won't *ever* approve Turkish accession... until the Turks finally outbreed us within our own country, and hold the democratic majority.
I think what you meant is that the Germans won't approve accession, which is probably true. On my part, I think Turkish accession is stupid because I don't consider Turkey part of Europe. It'd be like asking Russia to join NAFTA because they once owned Alaska.
"I think he specifically campaigned as a right-liberal."ReplyDelete
Before reading Richardson, I had no idea what "right-liberal" meant. I would have considered him a "conservative" along with the protectionists. I just would have seen them as occupying different spots on the spectrum.
You can laugh if you want at my erstwhile naivete, but you'd be laughing at a lot of other "conservatives" too. It is necessary for them, if not for you, that Richardson identify right-liberalism as something distinct from (and not just a more "moderate" kind of) conservatism.
Mr. Richardson wrote,ReplyDelete
"He is blind to the idea that the UK might exist for purposes other than trade."
This is an excellent point. Of course the Turkish PM suffers no such blindness.
""It is necessary for them, if not for you, that Richardson identify right-liberalism as something distinct from (and not just a more "moderate" kind of) conservatism.""ReplyDelete
It is not really that bad a thing to identify right-liberals as such if it is a correct identification, which i believe it is.
Cameron is so limp it seems that right liberal might be too strong a word.ReplyDelete
On another point entirely there is a show on the ABC being put out, "Dick Smith's population puzzle". Obviously talking about the issue.
MEP Danial Hannan claims friendliness to Turkey is a natural trait in British conservatives and has been so since the Crimean War and the fact Turkey was considered a bulwark against Russian expanding to the West yet it clearly overlooks Turkey's mistreatment of its Christian minority in that period, not to mention the 1915 genocide.ReplyDelete
Hannan is no conservative. He believes wholeheartedly in the Proposition Nation and recently described the BNP as an "anti-British party."