tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6832901.post2452960843955369443..comments2024-03-25T19:48:24.624+11:00Comments on Oz Conservative: What really drives Putnam?Unknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger12125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6832901.post-91419505122209204152009-08-20T12:29:28.912+10:002009-08-20T12:29:28.912+10:00"Thus the central challenge for modern, diver..."Thus the central challenge for modern, diversifying societies is to create a new, broader sense of 'we'."<br /><br />But Putnam does not practice what he preaches. He had a very inclusive "we" as gentile, and he converted to Judaism to get the private benefits of in-group loyalty. He wants the advantages of a narrow sense of "we" while forcing everyone else to make do with a wider, less loyal community.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6832901.post-37556796401376257662009-07-19T22:52:16.156+10:002009-07-19T22:52:16.156+10:00Hello Susan,
It is now late July, 2009. In just a...Hello Susan,<br /><br />It is now late July, 2009. In just a few weeks it will be 2 years since your post. <br /><br />Uh, how is that $US44 trillion looking these days?<br /><br />I hope your flood of new inhabitants into the US over recent decades have been getting themselves an education, say in the Protestant Work Ethic for example.<br /><br />Good luck.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6832901.post-87487206385784156392007-08-07T15:04:00.000+10:002007-08-07T15:04:00.000+10:00Who will be supporting the US Baby-Boomers by Soci...<EM>Who will be supporting the US Baby-Boomers by Social Security contributions, when the BBs don't even reach replacement levels in their breeding habits (too busy chasing BMWs and vacation homes)?</EM><BR/><BR/>Our current crop of immigrants are not going to want to support "old white people" so that's a red herring. And in fact the native-born US population reproduces at exactly replacement level (we American whities reproduce at a higher level than you antipodeans or the Europeans -- we don't increase, but neither do we decline). We have no need to import tens of millions of illiterate Third Worlders to prop up the Boomers. And in fact the Boomers are set to inherit something like 44 trillion dollars from the "Greatest Generation" that proceeded them -- in a very short order.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6832901.post-20098700902527289702007-08-07T14:59:00.000+10:002007-08-07T14:59:00.000+10:00The reason that consumerism is so rife in the US i...The reason that consumerism is so rife in the US is because of the relentless culture wars that have been launched on our traditional culture over the past 40 years or so. Our religion, our history, our culture, our family systems, even lately our language has been relentlessly attacked by the left. What do you do when you have nothing left? You consume and consume and consume. Consumerism has filled the vacuum where traditional Anglo-American culture used to reside.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6832901.post-61895407233552962712007-07-05T23:29:00.000+10:002007-07-05T23:29:00.000+10:00I think it obvious "a" civilization will continue ...I think it obvious "a" civilization will continue in the US, the question is which one? As things stand now, there is little incentive for your average white male to raise a family, and plnety of culutral pressure not to. Materialism and consumption (not just feminism) have gotten so bad that public interest groups have started putting out advertisements - yes, advertisements - to discourage people from consumer spending and to start saving instead (I found that kind of ironic in the land where consumption through debt is KING). Right now, our economy depends upon conspicuous consumption. I doubt these ads will put much of a dent in it.<BR/><BR/>The effect of this consumption is to continuously put off responsible parenthood, often permanently. I know many professional people in their 30's that, rather than raising a family, flat out admit it would "cramp" their lifestyle and would just prefer not to.<BR/><BR/>Not a good sign. Or maybe it is - perhaps this is simply a built-in corrective to remove the uber-selfish.<BR/><BR/>Sure, things are not necessarily irreversible. But I see very little reason to believe they will change. More important, I see little effort to reverse things, and plenty of effort to go even further in the wrong direction.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6832901.post-33083470706884327442007-07-05T20:46:00.000+10:002007-07-05T20:46:00.000+10:00C Matt,There's nothing inevitable about birth rate...C Matt,<BR/><BR/>There's nothing inevitable about birth rates. Western birth rates fell gradually during first wave feminism (from rougly the 1870s to the 1940s), then rose significantly during the feminist lull of the 1950s and 60s, then fell again with the advent of second and third wave feminism.<BR/><BR/>No society continues on by accident. Either the conditions of life for a civilisation are fought for and won, or else they are lost.<BR/><BR/>If we were serious about our future existence (which currently we are not) we would never allow family formation to be disrupted by political movements like feminism. We would encourage the natural instincts toward love, marriage and children, rather than move heaven and earth to discourage them.<BR/><BR/>Here in Australia even a few words of encouragement by the treasurer seem to have spurred along a small rise in the birth rate. Imagine if we were really serious about it.Mark Richardsonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15961688379656119701noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6832901.post-69641985041393365892007-07-04T02:18:00.000+10:002007-07-04T02:18:00.000+10:00There is no "force of nature" type reason that cur...<I>There is no "force of nature" type reason that current immigration policies have to remain in place. They could definitely be changed if there were a shift in political climate.</I><BR/><BR/>Not sure what you mean, but "force of nature" to me means demographics, specifically, birthrates. It seems undisputed that certain ethnicities "outbreed" others. And your typical WASP is not in the winner's circle. From this point of view, it is a force of nature. Who will be supporting the US Baby-Boomers by Social Security contributions, when the BBs don't even reach replacement levels in their breeding habits (too busy chasing BMWs and vacation homes)? To that extent, the Prof seems correct on his force of nature observation.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6832901.post-14921196280317282612007-06-28T12:44:00.000+10:002007-06-28T12:44:00.000+10:00Also, Putnam is apparently busy trying to defend h...Also, Putnam is apparently busy trying to defend himself against conservatives' charges of dishonesty here, among other places:<BR/><BR/>http://blog.beliefnet.com/crunchycon/2007/06/bad-news-on-the-diversity-fron.htmlJohn Savagehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09204911551117542124noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6832901.post-30476799536821631072007-06-28T12:34:00.000+10:002007-06-28T12:34:00.000+10:00Mark and Scott,I just wanted to alert you, in case...Mark and Scott,<BR/><BR/>I just wanted to alert you, in case you're not in the habit of reading this segment of the blogosphere: You might be interested in the discussion that's been going on today over at The American Scene about the Putnam findings. Here's a link:<BR/><BR/>http://www.theamericanscene.com/tags/immigrationJohn Savagehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09204911551117542124noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6832901.post-88460231392426400952007-06-28T07:38:00.000+10:002007-06-28T07:38:00.000+10:00Scott, exactly. It's the closest Putnam gets to re...Scott, exactly. It's the closest Putnam gets to revealing the political agenda behind all the second tier arguments.<BR/><BR/>John, a good comment, thanks. The professor's arguments about creativity are so abstract, so careless of real processes, that I took them to be there for "persuasive" purposes only.Mark Richardsonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15961688379656119701noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6832901.post-82571976569457210352007-06-28T00:52:00.000+10:002007-06-28T00:52:00.000+10:00Just one comment: Let's recall why many of those i...Just one comment: Let's recall why many of those immigrant Nobel Prize winners came to America back in the 1930's. Not something you'd expect to be repeated.<BR/><BR/>Counting the refugees from Hitler's Europe as "immigrants" and then using that to justify immigration of illiterate Mexicans is beyond dishonest, don't you think?<BR/><BR/>Hmmm... I think I see the next Einstein coming across the border right this minute! Get him a green card!John Savagehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09204911551117542124noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6832901.post-70553504356370414672007-06-27T20:36:00.000+10:002007-06-27T20:36:00.000+10:00Another clue is on p 138/9 where Prof. Putnam says...Another clue is on p 138/9 where Prof. Putnam says "In the medium to long run, on the other hand, successful immigrant societies create new forms of social solidarity and dampent the negative effects of diversity by constructing new, more encompassing identities. Thus the central challenge for modern, diversifying societies is to create a new, broader sense of 'we'."<BR/><BR/>A more classical case of liberal optimism and illusions I think will be hard to find. It also suggests that governments have a role to play in stripping its citizenry of their existing identity to create this 'broader sense of 'we'.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com